COSMOFACTORY

[00:00:00] This episode is about responsible production. It's about supply chain opportunities that support a circular beauty economy. It's about the power our industry has to model positive change throughout the consumer goods sector. It's about closed loop beauty packaging, and so much more today. My guest is Jo Chidley, founder of Beauty Kitchen and Reposit Jo, welcome to CosmoFactory.
Thanks for inviting me. I'm excited [00:01:00] about today.
Know of course, I'm glad for the chance to speak with you. Um. Sometimes I describe the beauty industry as sort of a gateway industry because it's not uncommon to see companies introducing technologies or founders bringing purpose-driven brands into beauty in a way that, um, can build consumer awareness, demonstrate consumer buy-in, or shift consumer purchasing behavior in a way that will affect sectors beyond beauty.
As I understand it, you have created an independent beauty brand in order to establish, um. I should say, maybe to set an example for the larger consumer goods industry, tell us, if you will, about the mission of Beauty Kitchen. I.
So when Beauty Kitchen started out, we were, we were really on a mission to transform. Uh, the beauty industry and really the wider, as you said, consumer goods sector, um, by putting sustainability and circularity at the very heart of everything that we do. What this means is that it's going beyond [00:02:00] the surface level of, you know, marketing, um, but really embedding responsibility into the DNA of our, our business.
So. It. It was really a simple but powerful belief that we should be using business as a force for good. And that's a strap line from B Corp certification. We are a B Corp certified business, but actually that's just good business practice in my eyes, so that's why I like to use that. And really from the beginning, we wanted to challenge the norms of the industry from how products are made.
And packaged to how they are used and returned. Um, and really, you know, our strap line is effective, um, natural sustainable. So efficacy is always our prime, you know, and we are as an industry, really good at efficacy. Yeah. Natural. We have been on a journey as an industry without a doubt, particularly over the last 10 years, but the last five years there's been a such [00:03:00] an increase in the availability of natural ingredients.
But sustainability is one of those words that's very broad. It's very hard to define what that is. And what we wanted to do with Beauty Kitchen is give a definition of, of what that means and really the big. White elephant in the room is packaging. Yeah, because we, we need to have our products packaged, not just from an aesthetic perspective, but also from, you know, um, looking after the formulations.
You, you know, that's within them. That's really key. But I think we got. Pretty lazy as an industry on, you know, what does that actually mean? And we've just gone to a certain material and a certain way of doing things. And what we wanted to demonstrate was this could be different not just for our business beauty kitchen, but actually for the industry built beyond.
And, and, and that's really what I always want to do is. Yes, you said lead [00:04:00] by example, but it's it's definitely taken people with us. It's taking other businesses and that's where, for me, community is really, really important because a small indie brand, the impact that we can give is, is small and will always continue to be small.
Where the big impact is, is giving those ideas. To much larger organizations and the industry at large, for them to take that in their own way and, and, and start to move in a different direction.
Yes. That's wonderful. Wonderful. Thank you for sharing. Um, you, you suggested this idea of responsibility and I know, um, we will definitely get to. Packaging more directly later on in our conversation. Um, but there's this idea of, of really producing responsibility that I think is, is behind your brand. Help us think about what that means for brands like yours, other brands, but manufacturers, and maybe even retailers as well.
What does producing responsibly mean?
For me, if you think of the way the economy is built at the moment, [00:05:00] we take something, we make it, and then we sell it on, and we think that our responsibility really ends there. Although we'll have customer service in whatever format, that's where it ends. But business is transforming to a circular loop.
And what that means is that you need to think about what happens upstream. So when you take, whether it's ingredients or packaging, you still have a responsibility of a, who you're taking it from and how can you support them to do things differently. Then you make your product, you then sell it, but again, downstream, you are then still responsible for where those ingredients.
Or packaging or other aspects of your business end up. And that is a much broader way of looking at your responsibility as a business. One, it's the right thing to do, but two, it can unlock such innovation and opportunity for your business. And that for me is what really excites me. But also it excites the industry because in beauty, innovation and [00:06:00] opportunity is, is why we exist.
Yeah. No, that's fantastic. I love, I love this idea of, of innovation opportunities, you know, and, and certainly previous guests here on Cosmo. Have pointed to circularity in the same way that, that you are, you know, really calling it an opportunity for innovation. Can you say more about that? Um, the opportunity that's there.
What, what the beauty kitchen perspective on that might be.
So, um, it can be ingredient led. So if we take two, you know, trends at the moment, upcycled ingredients, which I know is, is, is huge at the moment, which we've been using for a long time. And also micro alies in the power of micro alies. You know, these two, uh, one is a waste product that's becoming a resource that's very much the circular economy.
And then with micro alies, when you produce that ingredient, it produces energy and closes the loop. So you know, not only does it absorb carbon dioxide and and convert it to oxygen. Which we need. [00:07:00] It also releases energy. So I think it's, again, looking at the lens of efficacy, but then looking at the lens of sustainability.
And if you can bring both of those together, you have a very powerful, active ingredient that not only does great things for your skin, but can actually do great things to regenerate the planet. That's the key for me.
Yeah. Yeah. No, I love it. Can you tell us about maybe some of the efforts your team has made and what you've been able to accomplish in terms of unlocking responsibility of the supply chain in particular? And I know your work has been intentional in that direction. Do you have examples we can learn from?
So I think one of the prime examples would be we use, uh, manufacturers here in the uk and one of those manufacturers we use renewable energy for, for beauty kitchen sites. But, but it's our extended supply chain that that's where. The big emissions are, and one of our manufacturing sites, we supported [00:08:00] them in the transition to renewable energy.
And the way that we did that is that we said we would lean in, in terms of the difference in costs, if there was any. So y yeah. And we then, you know, take, took the burden of that, not just individually, but what that did is that then encouraged other brands to lean into that manufacturer as well. And that's what it is.
It's this power of community. You do not need to do this on your own. In fact. You would be mad to do it on your own. It's finding other like-minded businesses to come together to then unlock that you are de-risking. And also minimizing the costs, both from a resource perspective but also from the financial perspective.
And again, that's key. It also then helps develop that relationship. It really. Bonds you with your, uh, supply chain. And that is also key in terms of if you're looking at a circular supply chain, you cannot just look through the lens of cost. If you do that, you will never be able to innovate or [00:09:00] protect your business or future proof your business.
Yeah. No, that makes very good sense. Thank you. I did promise our listeners, and you suggested earlier that we would talk specifically about beauty packaging. Certainly. Um, in recent years, packaging suppliers have made important changes, sourcing better materials, using thoughtful design to minimize waste.
Uh, even investing in regional manufacturing, you've pointed to the value in that, um, in terms of product as well. But at the same time, certainly some would argue that there is no such thing as sustainable beauty packaging. I'm hoping you'll tell us about, um, the business you have called reposit and what your vision for packaging as a service is.
So Reposit is our, uh, returnable packaging platform. And what that means is it helps brands and retail. Dealers to, you know, ditch single use packaging in favor of a closed loop system that actually works. The idea is simple. Customers buy products in durable returnable packaging that's already fit [00:10:00] for reuse.
So we use a lot of glass in our industry. We use a lot of aluminum. We use. Not necessarily in personal care, but in home care, which is a, you know, a very, very close complementary, um, category for us, we use stainless steel. All of these materials are already in the format sizes that we require for our industry, and they're already fit for reusability.
So the customer then uses them and then the return, the, the empty packaging via a participant participating reposit. Partner now that can either be in store or it can be by post, or it can be through drop off points. And even in the UK it can be collected from home. So there's, you know, we, that customer journey we want to make as easy and seamless as possible.
But the, the other part that we do is that we also have a washing facility where we can wash all of the packaging and have the appropriate cleaning [00:11:00] protocols. Now, this is an interesting area because Reposit and Beauty Kitchen, we do not want to be washing specialists. So we have had the support of other, you know, um, experts in this area, and that is where the growth of this.
Would be with other washing facilities as well. That would be local, you know, and modular, depending on where people wanted to introduce the reposit, the reposit system. The other great thing about OSI is its cross category, so we, we use it in different categories. We have started in our homeland, which is beauty and personal care.
We've moved into. Home care, which is obviously adjacent to that, which makes it simple. And very recently we launched into served beverages, which is like coffees and ice drinks, et cetera. So what that means as a consumer or end user, it means that if I have my coffee in the morning. Or I've went and bought my [00:12:00] moisturizer from, you know, a retailer in store.
I can then return it to a retailer like Marks and Spencer's, where I've maybe picked up washing up liquid. So it's about how we live our lives as a consumer rather than this system is only available. To you when you buy certain products, it's trying to get that cross category collaborative approach where reposit is the intel inside.
Yeah. So when you think of laptops, you've got the Intel inside Reposit sits behind the brands and retailers. We are not at the forefront, but it's really easy for the end consumer to be able to return that packaging. And if you think of returns. Yeah, the return behavior has, you know, significantly increased, particularly in the global North where, you know, fortunately or unfortunately, depending on your opinion, fast fashion has been, you know, something that you know [00:13:00] has grown significantly.
But with fast fashion has been high returns, and that return system has meant that our mentality as a consumer, we know how to access that. So we are just tapping into something that is very similar. Yes, but we are doing it in a responsible way because if you return. Glass packaging, aluminium packaging, and stainless steel.
You only need to return them either once or three times for it to have, you know, a meaningful, um, return on the sustainability elements, whichever data you're looking at. Yes. And. You know, a lot of people do challenges on, you know, the differences. For instance, glass is heavy. Yes. And we've debunked a lot of those myths.
I won't go into this in, in the podcast. We have a lot of that information available through either our social channels or on our websites, or if anybody wanted to touch base personally, I can go through, you know, where that data has [00:14:00] come from, what you need to do to make things more sustainable, particularly with packaging.
Is, get them returned. That's the main idea. Return behavior is what you have to unlock and to get return behavior, you have to reward your end user, the consumer, and that's how we do it.
No, that's wonderful. People often point to consumer behavior change. Um. And the opportunities it can create, you know, in the, in the marketplace. I know, you know, on demand services when everyone started, you know, using Uber or Instacart or these sorts of, um, sharing economy pieces, um, was pointed to as a significant change.
And I, I, I think what you're saying about, um, the return of fast fashion, right? That that practice that now is so common for folks to send things back to where they bought them for whatever reason. I think it's, it's, it's brilliant to monopolize on that. Um, that consumer behavior absolutely.
And there's definitely a [00:15:00] latent consumer demand. I mean, you know, I think, um, I can't remember which retailer. It was, but somebody said recently that, you know, consumers are not going to reward you for being more sustainable, but they will certainly punish you if you are not, uh, uh, you know, and I think we need to be really mindful because again, a lot of people talk about the additional costs that may be involved with, um, you know, the, the sustainability or the ethical element.
I'm not necessarily sure I agree with that, but what I do agree with is that anything that is on its scale up will automatically be more expensive in the short term until you get to that scale. And that's just normal business practice. We're not doing anything different to any other business practices, but what we do need is the more people, the more businesses that are in the community, this, the, the quicker the scale will happen and then the quicker on the returns.
Yes. That makes very good sense. And you know, even what you're saying there [00:16:00] in terms of, you know, sort of the scale of participation. Uh, with businesses and companies. And, and you've also suggested that there's a lot of collaboration, um, going on here. Can you say something about how you're, you know, solving for these challenges and collaborating really with so many different players?
You mentioned even a handful of industries that you've involved already. That's a, that's a lot to manage. How are you, how are you doing that?
It is, I mean, you know, the amount, the amount of stakeholders that we have to manage was very deliberate. Because we wanted the stakeholders. If you think of our industry, we have packaging manufacturers, we have retailers, we have brands, we have the end consumer, we have the logistics that, that, that, that surround that and many other things that, that I haven't mentioned.
And what we wanted to do was bring all of those stakeholders together. To tell us what the solution needed to be for them. What were all the objectives? You, um, sorry, objections, you know, what were the reasons why it wouldn't [00:17:00] work in their particular business mindset? We did that three years ago through a variety of different workshops, and we had many different voices in the room.
What that did is that brought down that, um, competition where everyone, although you had mixed retailers and brands in the same room, they knew they were there to solve the same problem. And, and that really helped to unlock, move collaboration from something that is very much talking about to collective action, where it's very much action orientated.
How do we definitely move the dial on this? And that was really key for us.
Yeah. No, that's wonderful. That's wonderful. Thank you for sharing. Um, you and I had the chance to speak earlier this year, and, and when we did, you told me that the impact that Beauty Kitchen and Reposit is having in our industry, um. It can very much be attributed to the fact that your team is, um, small and nimble.
Uh, you, you told me, and, and we hear this expression a [00:18:00] lot, you fail cheap and you fail fast. But also you told me that you are loud. Um, and I think the ripple effect that you're making in beauty is due in large part to how widely known beauty kitchen is. You know, certainly there. There's no shortage of sustainability focused indie beauty brands out there.
Um, but many people I hear, I hear Beauty Kitchen repeated back to me from, you know, multinational suppliers and, and what have you often, um, I'm, I'm wondering, um, what we can learn from your communication and impact strategies. What can other, um, brands and companies be doing that you're doing to make this, um, you know, make the impact of, of circularity even, even bigger, faster.
I mean, I, I, I think I just, in my DNA, I'm a really curious person, and what happens with curiosity is that people answer your questions, which makes me even more passionate about what they're. They're involved in. Um, I also believe that if we come back to what I talked about in [00:19:00] terms of moving from a linear economy to a more circular based, where you are looking upstream as well as downstream.
So, you know, there is very few, although there's lots more than there ever was going to much more industry ingredient and packaging events rather than just brand and retailer events. And I think if you are. Looking at your voice across many different channels and many different areas of the supply chain.
These people do eventually come together in different, you know, at different, uh, conferences, trade shows and beyond, uh, award ceremonies and different things. And I think that's where, you know, it really works. The other aspect is. Um, the development and the rise of coalitions within our industry. So if we take things like the, um, sustainable Beauty Coalition, the B Corp Beauty Coalition, the e eco, um, beauty score, um, alongside, you know, PACT [00:20:00] Collective, there's, there's many others and, and I know there's no time to mention them all.
I do believe that that coming together. Of industry voices. Again, I'm involved in many of those different working committees and coalitions, and I think that just helps to engage and kinda debunk the myths of that. You need to always be competitive with each other when actually you can truly collaborate and still have the opportunity to compete.
And I think. You know, for me it's taking a, a leaf out of the way that sports people come together and they work very well together, you know, and then they're competing in races together. And I think, you know, that for me, I think makes it fun, but it then makes it realistic and it also, I think it makes it accessible.
I would never, ever want. Anyone in the industry to feel that they were excluded from the conversation. And I sometimes [00:21:00] feel that that happens with, um, sustainability, um, options or ethical options. Because as soon as you put labels on things, sometimes that then excludes because people think, well, I'm not sure that we are going to be.
I would rather we didn't, coalitions is a great word because that gives everyone the opportunity to lean in wherever they are in their journey and that's really key and important and I think that's what what then happens. The other thing is, I'm glad we do in Scottish, so automatically I'm just seem loud.
Well, Joe, your, your energy, um, your curiosity is certainly contagious and, and your work is very encouraging. I thank you, Joe for speaking with me here on the Cosmo Factory Podcast.
Thank
you for having me.
You're welcome.
I. [00:22:00]